Who does spilt blood belong to?
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On Oct 24 2005 3:54PM  gary.porter-jones wrote: 
I was asked this interesting question today and I think the answer is probably more complicated than I first thought. Can anyone advise?

A patient in a private psychiatric hospital is a known self-harmer. She has her own cubicle. She cuts herself and bleeds onto the floor. She prevents staff from cleaning it up because she says the blood is her property and she wants to leave it where it is so she can look at it later! She says the blood is legally hers and the staff have no right to clean it up. She will clean it up herself tomorrow (after she's finished looking at it!!). Because the blood is in her room and she doesn't share the room with anyone else, she says that nobody else is at risk if it stays there for a couple of days. She is a former lawyer and presumably has some knowledge of the law(!) What are your thoughts on the legal and practical implications of this?
Regards
Gary
On Oct 24 2005 5:06PM  karen.hawker wrote: 
Some of my thoughts.
Unless she has a lock on the door so no-one else can get in it is putting others at risk, for example cleaners or domestic staff if not from BBVs then from slipping. If the hospital allows her to keep the blood there & there is an accident, whose responsibility is the accident?
If the blood is soaking into the hospital's floor (what is the floor made of?) Then it is damaging the property of the hospital & any property rights are in conflict.
Also there are some intersting psychiatric aspects in there. Is it condusive to her mental health for her to be looking at the blood?
On Oct 26 2005 5:18PM  jean.lawrence wrote: 
Hello
I sought advice on this as I work in a Mental Health Trust. The following response is from the Director of Nursing and Clinical Governance:
"The patient is neither the owner or occupier of the building or room and hence has no say in how the room is cleaned. The room is owned and serviced by the Trust for the sole purpose of treating in-patients. The room is therfore not hers. She could be moved at any time hence the room should be fit for purpose at all times. We have the Duty of Care under Health and Safety legislation that would prevent us from just leaving it on the floor. The reason for her wanting the blood to remain on the floor is indicative of her mental state."
Clean the room and spills as soon as possible.
Jean Lawrence
Chair ICNA
On Oct 28 2005 10:58AM  beejaye.nunkoo wrote: 
I read Jean's response, quoting the Director of Nursing (DoN) in an NHS hospital. I'm afraid this happens to take place in a private hospital where the DoN may take a different view, more in consultation with the patient's Psychiatrist. The patient, as the customer, has her own opinion, beit right or wrong, and cannot be ignored. The DoN may take the view that the patient's condition may be aggravated by a confrontational attitude - she may stab herself again as soon as the spillage is cleared. I believe that therapeutic counselling would be more productive, and the consultant psychiatrist should be more pursuasive.
On Oct 28 2005 12:16PM  james.crocker wrote: 
My thoughts, for whatever they may be worth, are:
Blood is a great medium for bacterial growth so spilt blood may quickly become colonised; therefore the argument that someone is not at risk from their own blood ceases to be legitimate once it is left for a day or two (as well as the "slip" hazard mentioned in a previous reply).
If the product this lady chose to look at on her floor were her faeces, would that be any different? I don't believe so. I think it's a hazardous waste material that the hospital has a duty to quickly remove. Knowingly leaving such material exposed in a hospital would, I believe, be far harder to defend than any challenge to cleaning it based on ownership.
Of course if you have some kind of legal team / support for the hospital it may well be worth discussing with them.

James Crocker
On Oct 28 2005 3:03PM  jacqui16 wrote: 
May seem like a silly question...... but what is this patient cutting herself with? And why is she able to have implements that she can use to injure herself to such an extent that it would leave a blood spill on the floor?
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